The Oregon Trail

On this week’s episode, Colleen has a Bridgerton hyper-fixation and we find out if everyone has an Adam's apple. Then we get into the topic of the week… THE OREGON TRAIL. Bridget explains how the US expanded West, what life was like on the road and covers the horrific story of the Donner Party. We end with a disturbing Reddit thread of “things my partner hid from me” and people are truly not okay. Come with us on this trek to the wild, wild West while we try not to get run over by a wagon!! #YouHadDiedOfDysentery 

Sources:

• History That Doesn’t Suck: Episode 30 and Episode 31 hosted by Greg Jackson
• Oregon Trail from History.com
• Wikipedia

Review and subscribe! You can find us on Instagram @Sippinwiththeshannons or send us your stories at Sippinwiththeshannons@gmail.com. Love you, mean it.

Transcript

Speaker: 0:02

Pour me a glass of rosé, I'll make it a Chardonnay. Come on, you're sippin with the Shannon's. Oh, if it's Reese and Rimbaud or a Pinot Grigio, you know you're sippin with the Shannon's.

Speaker 2: 0:22

I went for a walk the other night and At Castle Island. No song in your heart today? No, I need to say this first before I forget. Oh wow,

Speaker 3: 0:30

okay.

Speaker 2: 0:31

Just now, I was walking the other night and someone, a Subaru of course, because I just like, Subarus are just so ugly, had a bumper sticker that said, I heart to fart. And I just walked by and I thought to myself, imagine our ancestors. Did all of these things for us to be driving around here with a bumper sticker that says that

Speaker 3: 0:46

yeah

Speaker 2: 0:47

And this is where we're at. This is what they

Speaker 3: 0:49

we eventually got the right to drive so we could drive Subarus that say I love to fart on them.

Speaker 2: 0:56

I Stopped into my tracks and I said, you know what? I'm sorry.

Speaker 3: 1:01

I Just want to send a quick Quick sorry, up to the ancestors. They

Speaker 2: 1:05

were fighting for their lives, putting on petticoats every single day, and snatching their waste, and like literally not making it over the ocean to get here, and like dying of like the plague and shit, and then this is where we're at.

Speaker 3: 1:15

On coffin ships.

Speaker 2: 1:17

Where

Speaker 3: 1:17

So that we can have I heart to fart.

Speaker 4: 1:21

That's all.

Speaker 3: 1:22

Oh wow. Hey. How you doing?

Speaker 4: 1:25

Good. How are you?

Speaker 3: 1:26

Good. Uh, hi everyone. Welcome to this week's episode of Sippin with the Shannons. We're cousins and each week we sit down, we sip on some wine. She's making faces. We talk some shit and we have a good giggle. I'm Bridget Shannon.

Speaker 2: 1:38

And I'm Colleen Shannon.

Speaker 3: 1:40

How you doing, bud?

Speaker 2: 1:41

You know,

Speaker 3: 1:43

You look a little red.

Speaker 2: 1:44

Oh, I'm a tomato.

Speaker 3: 1:46

Tomato. Sweet tomato. I

Speaker 2: 1:48

sat outside for literally 15 minutes and then was like just reading my book cause I needed to find peace during work and I came back in and I said, Oh, look at, she's looking a little freckly. And then I like did my thing and took a shower and I was like, Oh no, she's not freckly. She is. But, a tomato.

Speaker 3: 2:03

Turnt to burnt.

Speaker 2: 2:04

Turnt to burnt. But you know, the vibes are different. The vibes are different. And it's just a Mother's Day weekend. Oh my god, what's wrong with me? Memorial Day weekend's coming up. I was gonna

Speaker 3: 2:11

say, that

Speaker 2: 2:11

was last

Speaker 3: 2:12

week.

Speaker 2: 2:12

The sun is out. I just, I'm ready to put my pussy out there this weekend. I'm ready.

Speaker 3: 2:18

You're ready to pop your pussy? I

Speaker 2: 2:19

am.

Speaker 3: 2:20

I'm ready for you to pop your pussy too. You've, you've been somewhat tamed. It's time to, to let the beast out.

Speaker 2: 2:27

So like, I don't have any stories from like this, my weekend, this weekend, but just know the next weekend I'll make up for it. And I think I might even try to get work off on Saturday cause it looks nice out. Like, who the fuck is she?

Speaker 3: 2:37

Who is she? Who

Speaker 2: 2:38

the fuck is she? Who the fuck? Yeah, no, I have nothing to say that I did this weekend. I did go to a really fancy schmancy restaurant with my boss and like someone else that we work with. Like, for work purposes. Whatever. Not exciting. And we walked in and I literally said out loud, I do not belong here. I am a bull in a china shop. Like this, it's Where

Speaker 3: 2:54

did you go? It's a new restaurant

Speaker 2: 2:56

in Raffles. It's a hotel.

Speaker 3: 2:57

Okay.

Speaker 2: 2:58

And I don't know. It was just wicked bougie. Like we went upstairs to get a drink before on like the sky deck and people were having tea. Like, full of fancy tea. Oh, okay. It's one of those. no. They didn't have Chicken

Speaker 3: 3:08

Pringles and French Fries for you?

Speaker 2: 3:09

Oh, no. Like, they were, like, filling up the waters when, like, I was, like, taught, like, when I wasn't looking. Like, you know, it was one of those places. They were filling up. Like, we didn't have to interact. They were just doing.

Speaker 3: 3:20

That's a crazy thing to say. It

Speaker 2: 3:22

was crazy. And, like, it's a place where I, like, wouldn't have put my bag on the floor. Like that kind of place. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Which is what I do. I do that everywhere.

Speaker 3: 3:29

Did you keep your shoes on?

Speaker 2: 3:30

Yes, but I did at one point. I

Speaker 3: 3:33

knew there was going to be a but.

Speaker 2: 3:34

My phone like went flying off the table and just like smacked on the ground wicked loud. And I reached down and go get it and I hit my knee on the bottom of the table and everything was like, woo! The top

Speaker 3: 3:46

of the table, everything's

Speaker 2: 3:47

shakes. And I go, I told you guys, I don't belong here. What did you eat? We got like a bunch of random shit on the menu, but there was like a pasta situation that was going on with like truffle and like, that was good. I just like nibbled on that a little bit. And I'm usually there for the drinks. That's usually my vibe. Yeah, that's fair. I got a good espresso. They had Parmesan, Parm, Parmesan.

Speaker 3: 4:06

Parmesan?

Speaker 2: 4:06

Parmesan steeped like espresso vodka or something. Like it was Parmesan. I'll try to find the menu, but it was crazy. And that was what was in the espresso martini. It didn't taste like parmesan cheese, but just because it was like,

Speaker 3: 4:19

did it taste like cheese?

Speaker 2: 4:20

There was like a mist of it, I guess.

Speaker 3: 4:23

A mist.

Speaker 2: 4:23

A mist of cheese. A misting of parmesan. Like I'm down for cheese in anything. Give it to me.

Speaker 3: 4:29

The lactose intolerant girlies can't though. On top of an espresso? I mean,

Speaker 2: 4:33

it was just like steaming. Speaking of I

Speaker 3: 4:34

heart to fart. Jesus.

Speaker 2: 4:37

I would say that like it's like if someone is, I'm looking at my lips. Like a shaving.

Speaker 3: 4:41

Like, you know how some, they like, do the shave.

Speaker 2: 4:43

Or like, if you were like, allergic to raspberries, but if you put raspberry vodka in raspberries and like, steep it for a couple days, like, I feel like you could still drink the vodka.

Speaker 3: 4:50

Sure!

Speaker 2: 4:51

And sometimes I think people are really dramatic about their allergies, like, are you really

Speaker 3: 4:55

Colleen, Colleen.

Speaker 2: 4:56

No, because at work all the time, like, she'll be like, oh do you happen to have, and I get gluten free, like that's, I totally get that, or like lactose intolerant, of course, but they'll be like, say something like, do you have, and I'll be like, no, and she'll be like, oh, okay, it's fine, I don't eat it anyways, but it's just like, okay, so you're not allergic, bitch.

Speaker 3: 5:10

No, some people just have a preference. Yeah,

Speaker 2: 5:11

that's fine, but like Like sometimes when I

Speaker 3: 5:13

travel

Speaker 2: 5:14

You're acting like I'm gonna kill, tell me if I'm gonna kill you, but if I'm not gonna kill you

Speaker 3: 5:17

Well, I'm not a big seafood eater and sometimes when I travel, they, because a lot of times where I'm in a group and they'll say, are there anything, are there any preferences that we should know about? And I just say, no fish. So they think it's an allergy, but it's not. I just won't eat it if it's fish. I mean, I would honestly, if you put a fish in front of me, I'd be like, oh, I'm going Looks amazing.

Speaker 2: 5:36

Oh, that looks divine. Yeah,

Speaker 3: 5:38

and eat the whole thing. Yeah,

Speaker 2: 5:39

like they ordered something called uni and I was like, oh, yum. And like some weird ass fucking clam. Like, I don't want anything that comes out of a shell like that. But weirdly, I am on like seafood boil and like crab TikTok. So I just watch people busting those things open all day and like slurping them up. Usually men though. But something about that makes me. Feel something. Feel something. So I think that's how I got there. Yeah,

Speaker 3: 6:01

I went to a cooking class in Brazil in February, and every single part of the cooking class was fish. And I was just like, yum, I'm starving. We're just gonna eat it, and we're gonna shut the fuck up about it. There were

Speaker 2: 6:11

people fishing at, uh, Castle Island the other night, and I just know that they were taking those home to sauté. Oh,

Speaker 3: 6:16

you know. Those fish have like a fourth eye coming out of their tail.

Speaker 2: 6:21

Yeah. There's no way that's fresh. But they were like out here like really and I was like there's no reason for them to be this amped up and like aggressive about it if they weren't like this isn't for living. Like you know like they were gonna saute those fuckers when they got home. Yeah. I just knew it. Very interesting characters. There were so many people I was like you guys we need to leave. I'm so overstimulated. It was not peaceful. I did not find peace. Don't go to Castle Island for real. It's not great. I have two new hyper fixations. Two. Great. I'm on this. food hyperfixation of They're not vegan, but they're like a veggie chicken. Oh the

Speaker 3: 6:54

nuggets. Yeah, you you have told me this

Speaker 2: 6:56

I can't stop why I was thinking about it today and I had to add it to my list of things to talk about

Speaker 3: 7:00

Why do we think that over just classic chicken nuggets where you're they're not? I'll

Speaker 2: 7:04

be like, you know Sometimes you get like a chicken cutlet or something and like a creepy like frozen chicken better

Speaker 3: 7:09

than chicken nuggets Are they better? I mean,

Speaker 2: 7:11

obviously, if I'm gonna go to, like, McDonald's and get, like, chicken nuggets, those are obviously better. But, like, if you buy a frozen one, you know, sometimes it's just, like, a little creepy and it's not even good in the air fryer. Yeah, and they

Speaker 3: 7:18

don't taste well.

Speaker 2: 7:19

Yes. They don't taste good. And they are, like, so crispy, crunchy.

Speaker 3: 7:23

Oh.

Speaker 2: 7:24

And they, like, don't really taste the difference. But it's also, like, not, like, fake chicken. It's, like, straight up just, like, plant protein. Like, you can just tell it's not chicken, but it's just, like, a little different.

Speaker 3: 7:31

And you're obsessed. It's not giving

Speaker 2: 7:32

wannabe. Yeah. I got like the Buffalo Boys. The Buffalo Boys. Okay. So good. So good. Be loving those. yeah. It was slay. And also, yeah. Bridgerton, obviously.

Speaker 3: 7:42

Okay. The carriage scene.

Speaker 2: 7:44

So when you were talking about the other day, it's so over advertised in my head. I'm like, Oh, she don't fucking watch it. And then I was like, okay, I did it. I'm not going to say anything. Oh

Speaker 3: 7:51

no. I know all about it.

Speaker 2: 7:53

I

Speaker 3: 7:53

do have moments, like kind of how you feel about Barbie.

Speaker 2: 7:55

Yeah.

Speaker 3: 7:56

Bridgerton has been everywhere. I'm talking every other Instagram post, like their marketing team is working so hard and I love that. I'm just like, I, we get it. We fucking get it. It's also not even the whole season.

Speaker 2: 8:08

No, that's really annoying actually. They cut it off on a terrible part. Yeah. But I think I'm gonna start talking like them.

Speaker 3: 8:13

Oh yeah? Can you give us an example? Give us a test run.

Speaker 2: 8:16

You must make haste!

Speaker 3: 8:21

I do understand the appeal. I'm a big Nicola fan. Because who the fuck isn't? She's perfect. Gotta watch Derry Girls actually. Derry Girls is the best. I have been a fan of hers for so long. But no, I, I get it. I understand. I was saying to you the other day. The bar is just so low. Like men just being like, I want you so bad in everyone's having PQs.

Speaker 2: 8:44

It's just like, it gives me hope, it really does. The women are

Speaker 3: 8:46

gasping for air. Which I get, I totally get. I watch the carriage scene, the violin pitbull song.

Speaker 2: 8:56

If I was to have a wedding, which I won't, I would want to walk down the aisle to that song.

Speaker 3: 9:00

Of course you would. Obviously. I bet it will skyrocket. That's annoying. I bet that will be a thing at weddings. That's

Speaker 2: 9:06

annoying.

Speaker 3: 9:07

You just want it for you.

Speaker 2: 9:08

Yeah, I do. For the wedding. I'm not going to have

Speaker 3: 9:11

from this hypothetical wedding that won't, it won't ever happen. Hypothetical

Speaker 2: 9:14

man that I have not met yet. Or maybe I have, I don't know.

Speaker 3: 9:16

Okay. But maybe one day we can manifest that.

Speaker 2: 9:18

Yeah. But did

Speaker 3: 9:19

you, did you like it? Was it good? Was it?

Speaker 2: 9:22

I'm obsessed. I never, I didn't watch the flashback queen Charlotte, uh, season, but I just, I think we should not to regress women. In time.

Speaker 3: 9:31

Right.

Speaker 2: 9:32

I love voting. But like, I'd be down to just sit and be a lady in the afternoon and wait for the gentleman callers in the living room.

Speaker 3: 9:40

Oh, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That sounds appealing. It sounds appealing.

Speaker 2: 9:43

Scrumptious. You just go to balls, all dolled up, and you just walk around and just be like, hello, my lord.

Speaker 3: 9:49

I want to do that on the side, though. Like, I don't want that to be my whole point of living Don, which I think is very guess. Yeah. Don't love that. They like,

Speaker 2: 9:55

don't love reading. Like, it's like, oh, you can't read like, ah, I wanna fucking read there's libraries. Just'cause I have a pussy doesn't mean I can't read I'm just saying No,

Speaker 3: 10:05

I totally

Speaker 2: 10:05

get it. I when they and wait, did you say you watched it or you just watched the carriage scene?

Speaker 3: 10:09

I didn't watch it, but I've seen it. I've seen it. Every clip I've essentially watched it without watching it.

Speaker 2: 10:14

Okay, so not a spoil alert because you've watched it already. If you're a Bridger trade man, you've watched it by now. Yeah.

Speaker 3: 10:18

People are binging it.

Speaker 2: 10:19

There's a scene with. The scene where he, she has like a, a person of interest. Yes. And she's never had like someone interested in her. Like, I'll cry right now. Like, it was so upsetting. And so he's like showing an interest and then he's like, How come you always sit in your window every day? Like, why do you choose that seat for reading? Like, your reading window. And it's the one that views the Bridgerton house in Collins. Like, that's where she sees Collins. And so when he figures that out, he was like, You don't love me. Like, well, and I was like, the way he said it, he was like, I, like, when he figures out that that's why I was like, Oh my God, this poor man. And like, she's just, it's so upsetting. And she just watches him from the window and just like wishes for someone to love her. Like it is so upsetting. Setting even her mom's like I'm so excited that you're gonna spend the rest of your life with me Cuz like they literally like she's lost cause like oh, they call her spinster.

Speaker 3: 11:09

I hate that. It's so mean So fucking mean

Speaker 2: 11:12

and I just want her and Eloise aren't friends because the lady whistle downs hitch

Speaker 3: 11:16

Yeah, cuz she found out and got pissed right? Yeah, what happened?

Speaker 2: 11:19

It was giving have you ever seen the movie The Duff?

Speaker 3: 11:21

The what?

Speaker 2: 11:22

The Duff It stands for Designated Ugly Fat Friend. I thought

Speaker 3: 11:25

you were saying Deaf. No. The Deaf. And I was like, someone who can't hear. Sorry. Yes. The Duff, I have seen.

Speaker 2: 11:32

Okay. It's giving modern day because she asked Colin to basically like, as a friend, help her out to like, get a man. Got it. So he's like, helping her and the whole time. After a while. He's falling for her. A man falls for her. And he's like, no, you can't be with him. And she's like, but why? That You know, it's like that. So she is

Speaker 3: 11:51

Enter the carriage scene.

Speaker 2: 11:52

Yes, correct.

Speaker 3: 11:53

I burn for you. Do men know that that's all they have to do? Is like watch these and then do some of those things? I

Speaker 2: 12:00

don't think they care enough.

Speaker 3: 12:02

Oh, that's a wicked fucking bummer.

Speaker 2: 12:06

I'm just saying. Like,

Speaker 3: 12:07

I'm on book talk, of course, because I read ACOTAR and I can't stop liking all of the stuff. In so many things, they're like, I just wish my husband would do this thing and I'm like imagine just

Speaker 2: 12:18

saying

Speaker 3: 12:19

imagine just saying could you read this book? And this is take notes, take notes, see you

Speaker 2: 12:25

then.

Speaker 3: 12:26

And it just not happening. Like if someone said to me, it would make me so happy if you just read this book, I would just read it. You know what I mean? Yeah, I don't know. It just feels simple.

Speaker 2: 12:38

Yeah. I don't know. Erin is slash was seeing this guy. And I mean, she's, she's fine. She's got a roster. But one of them, one of them in particular, like is like respectful question mark. And I keep being like. So when are you, like, gonna kiss him? They just, like, go out and, like, go out. Like, go for walks and, like, get ice cream. Oh, he

Speaker 3: 12:55

seems like a nice man. So I'm like, so when

Speaker 2: 12:56

is, I was like, she's like, he touched my leg. I'm like, when is he gonna peck, when are you gonna peck the peen? Like, what, I'm getting bored. What are you waiting

Speaker 3: 13:02

for? I get home

Speaker 2: 13:02

and I'm like, I'm, I'm bored. That's all. You need a

Speaker 3: 13:05

little more umph.

Speaker 2: 13:06

So it's just like, so they do exist, I guess. So that's just me saying. I would like the happy

Speaker 3: 13:11

medium of those two things.

Speaker 2: 13:13

Yeah, but I would want someone that would just like, What, you don't want to touch me? Like, hello.

Speaker 3: 13:17

Have you seen me?

Speaker 2: 13:18

No, but I just meant like, what? Is there something wrong? No, I know. Because I'm just, the norm is like, my friends being like, Oh, you know, first date thing, you know?

Speaker 3: 13:26

Like fucking on a first date. Yeah. Oh, okay. Or

Speaker 2: 13:28

like even before that. And then the day after, you know? Hey,

Speaker 3: 13:32

sometimes, you know? It's the way the cookie crumbles. I'm just

Speaker 2: 13:35

genuinely frozen in time and confusion. I can't compute. Oh lord. That's all I have. Oh my god, I went jean shopping on Sunday. Don't ever do it. Don't ever do it. It's the worst experience on the planet. It's such toxic behavior.

Speaker 3: 13:48

But here's the thing, it's not real. Every type of jean is different. The sizes are different. So what you'll be in one store, you won't be in another one. The lighting, the mirrors, none of it is actually how you look.

Speaker 2: 14:01

Yeah.

Speaker 3: 14:01

Jean shopping is the fucking worst.

Speaker 2: 14:04

It ain't it. Erin's like, go to Zara. I'm like, you think a bitch can wear

Speaker 3: 14:07

Zara? No, I've always done Express. You find your one store where you know your size, and you buy three or four different colors, and that's fucking that on that.

Speaker 2: 14:17

Hefty Helen like me ain't going in Zara. No, I wouldn't go to Zara. Zara.

Speaker 3: 14:22

Zara.

Speaker 2: 14:23

You've seen Sisters, right?

Speaker 3: 14:25

Yeah, because every time I say

Speaker 2: 14:26

Zara, I say it like Mara. Yeah. How was your weekend?

Speaker 3: 14:30

Well, it was, I mean, I was pretty boring. We went out to dinner for Lara's birthday, me and my best girlfriends. That was so nice and fun. And then I babysat. Like, I did not do anything crazy. Are we boring? We have become a little boring, but I think they're, the tides are changing. Okay. Okay. We haven't done anything super chaotic recently. It's very unlike us.

Speaker 2: 14:50

The sun is up. It's warmer. We come alive another time. Yeah.

Speaker 3: 14:55

It's, it's gotta happen, just not right now. Okay. Couple things. First of all, I went to look up the meme for the Hustled Bamboozleds Blood Astray Draw Rule tweet, right? Everything that popped up was Malcolm X, which he was a civil rights activist, and it's a movie with Denzel Washington who plays him. Yeah. Where he says, he doesn't say, all of those things, but he says a few of them while giving this like very impassioned political speech about what it's like to be black in this country. So

Speaker 2: 15:22

Ja Rule just stole that

Speaker 3: 15:22

from him? And I was like, one or two things is happening. Ja Rule just happened to do something similar, or he is comparing himself to Malcolm X. Like your Instagrammer. Influencer shit show event is somehow comparable to a civil rights activist. You're scraping. That is like him being like, I had a dream that this, these influencers could come to this island and pussy pop like that's fucking crazy. So I don't know what the truth is, but the minute it popped up, I was like, that's somehow this is worse. That's

Speaker 2: 15:57

true. That's true. Lulu. That did become true. Lulu.

Speaker 3: 16:01

Yeah. For real. That's true. Another thing, my cousin Paul Michael, hi Paul Michael, he listens to the pod.

Speaker 2: 16:05

Hey.

Speaker 3: 16:06

Actually, do you want to know something funny? His birthday is our yearly anniversary.

Speaker 2: 16:09

Oh, sorry.

Speaker 3: 16:10

Yeah, the first time we recorded was on his birthday. Paul Michael called and was like, please tell me you both know that women don't have Adam's apples. And I was like, yes,

Speaker 2: 16:19

yes. Did he start from the beginning?

Speaker 3: 16:21

What do you mean?

Speaker 2: 16:22

Cause didn't we just talk about that like two episodes ago? Yeah.

Speaker 3: 16:24

He's yeah. He's listening. Okay. And so we called him. He was like, you, you know, he

Speaker 4: 16:28

called to tell you this. Yes. Okay. And

Speaker 3: 16:30

he said, you fed into it. And I was like, we know. that women don't have Adams apples. Do we know that? You didn't know that? Look, we do. It's right here. No. No. What's

Speaker 4: 16:40

right here?

Speaker 3: 16:41

We have, it's not an Adams apple. Is it just like

Speaker 4: 16:44

a bump?

Speaker 2: 16:46

Sorry.

Speaker 3: 16:46

I'm sorry. I thought we were on the same page.

Speaker 2: 16:48

No.

Speaker 3: 16:51

Well, Paul Michael, we all learned something today because of you.

Speaker 2: 16:55

I have a friend that has one. I'm telling you.

Speaker 3: 16:57

She does. A female.

Speaker 2: 16:58

Yes. A gal. A gal pal. She has what I'm telling you, gal pal. It stares at me and we talk about it all the time. No,

Speaker 3: 17:06

Oh, wait. Oh, he's wrong. Wait, Paul. Michael, you're wrong.

Speaker 2: 17:10

Don't tell him and let him listen to us. It says,

Speaker 3: 17:12

yes, women can have Adam's apples, but they're usually less visible than men. Oh, okay. I knew we had less. I knew we had a little somethin somethin in

Speaker 2: 17:20

there. I knew it. I just knew it! What else does it say? It's a

Speaker 3: 17:24

secondary sex characteristic, meaning that men and women have different structures. So during puberty, the larynx in men grows bigger and faster than women, pushing the Adam's apple out, making it more prominent. So usually men have a more prominent one because of puberty.

Speaker 2: 17:38

So

Speaker 3: 17:39

that is the truth. So take that, Paul Michael. I can't wait for him to call me and be like,

Speaker 2: 17:45

you son of a

Speaker 3: 17:45

bitch.

Speaker 2: 17:48

I feel like when you, in the olden days, when you got your period, was it like, oh, now it's time to give birth? Is that how that worked? It worked.

Speaker 3: 17:53

Sorry?

Speaker 2: 17:54

Like if Oh! A woman came

Speaker 3: 17:56

to age. Yeah, it's ready to go. You're ready to go. Sorry, I was like, when you're pregnant, you don't get your period. I was very confused. Yes, when a woman's first bleed. So

Speaker 2: 18:07

you're telling me like back in the day, like in the fifth grade, I was ready to be sperminated?

Speaker 3: 18:12

If you were trying to marry Louis the 8th?

Speaker 2: 18:15

That's crazy. That's crazy. Henry the

Speaker 3: 18:18

8th? I meant Henry the 8th, not Louis. Simpler times. Probably him too though. Yeah.

Speaker 2: 18:21

Oh, is he the one with the Simpler times! Is that the one with the sores?

Speaker 3: 18:24

Yeah, the ulcers. The weeping ulcers. Oh. That's correct. That is correct.

Speaker 2: 18:28

I was on my way here going, Lady Shannon of Sipshot.

Speaker 3: 18:33

Oh my god, so I saw this video of the cast of Schitt's Creek. I just have to re watch that show, I'm so obsessed with it. And they were asking Annie Francis, they were asking the cast, like, what's their favorite Moira thing? And she says, do we know how this man expired is the sentence and Annie goes it's so funny because she somehow makes how four syllables and she's like do we know how this man expired and it is so fucking funny and I just love Moira Rose. She's everything.

Speaker 2: 19:05

She is the moment. She is iconic. She's everything.

Speaker 3: 19:08

Yep. Have you seen the Ashley Madison documentary?

Speaker 2: 19:11

No, it's on my list.

Speaker 3: 19:12

Colleen I have so many thoughts. I need you to watch it. I don't get

Speaker 2: 19:17

the concept. Can you give me a synopsis?

Speaker 3: 19:18

Do you know what Ashley Madison is, was Isn't

Speaker 2: 19:21

it like an app?

Speaker 3: 19:22

No. So Ashley Madison has been around for years and years and years now. Decades, I would say. And it was a Online service that catered to married people, mostly men. So married men, it was a dating site for married men. Oh, interesting. So you could be in a relationship, whole ass married with kids, and their entire marketing campaign was around you having fun on the side. Okay. And meeting up with people and having an affair.

Speaker 2: 19:54

Interesting.

Speaker 3: 19:55

Literally, I think one of their slogans is, Life is short, have an affair. And it was wildly successful because men are trash.

Speaker 2: 20:03

They really are.

Speaker 3: 20:05

It will not make you feel better about men. That is what I will say.

Speaker 2: 20:08

I mean, I already don't feel great about them, and I don't think I care.

Speaker 3: 20:11

Yeah, no, you have to watch it. indifferent

Speaker 2: 20:13

about them. I'm just like, you're there. You're whatever.

Speaker 3: 20:15

I think what's better about this, I mean, people do end up perishing, so I don't want to say it's like better than a A murder because people do pass away and it's like really one of the women, if anyone's watched it, the wife, she's just has more grace than I could ever hope to have and she's just a lovely, lovely person. But it's, it's so good. It's like a perfect true crime without watching people get like bludgeoned to death. Do you know what I mean?

Speaker 2: 20:46

Yeah. It's definitely not great, but it's not like It's not

Speaker 3: 20:49

great. It's not great. And he was

Speaker 2: 20:50

shot in the face three times. Right. And then

Speaker 3: 20:52

there was a serial killer who was attacking children. Like, it's not like that. There are aspects of it that are great, but it is so fucking good.

Speaker 2: 21:00

Okay. I'll give her a whirl. I'll consider it.

Speaker 3: 21:04

Alright, you ready for the topic of the day?

Speaker 2: 21:06

Yes, I meant to ask, did you tell me what it was and I just didn't listen?

Speaker 3: 21:09

We had a whole conversation about it, actually.

Speaker 2: 21:11

I completely was driving here and was thinking to myself, Hmm, I have no idea what Bridget's going to talk about today.

Speaker 3: 21:15

Yeah, we talked about it a lot. Yep. Yep.

Speaker 2: 21:19

I apologize.

Speaker 3: 21:19

That's okay, because I did all the research, so you don't, you just have to sit there and look cute and drink your wine. Me, a tomato? Me, a little tomato? We are going to talk about the Oregon Trail today.

Speaker 2: 21:30

Oh, right, yeah, the, uh, what was the disease?

Speaker 3: 21:33

Dysentery.

Speaker 2: 21:34

Dysentery. Because

Speaker 3: 21:35

I said to Colleen Should we do the work on trail because we get some submissions when we ask you guys, you know What should we talk about we get the classic, you know, we love when you ramble about stupid pop culture shit We love the true crime stuff and then other people are like I kind of like when you take a topic from history That's boring and make it fun and understandable. And so we're really

Speaker 2: 21:56

good at that.

Speaker 3: 21:57

We have all that was really nice of you to say Thank you. I actually really tried in this to do that. So we'll, we'll see how you feel at the end. But I said to her, well, why don't we do the Oregon trail? Because someone submitted the gold rush and was like, I don't know what the fuck that is. And she goes, what's the Oregon trail? And I said, Oh, it's that remember the, the video game you played on your computer and you would like die of dysentery and a bunch of pioneers did it. And she was like, what the fuck is dysentery? And I was like,

Speaker 2: 22:23

game that you die like that. Yeah. No.

Speaker 3: 22:25

Oh,

Speaker 2: 22:26

I was playing like Nintendogs.

Speaker 3: 22:28

Buckle up, girl.

Speaker 2: 22:28

Okay, I'm excited.

Speaker 3: 22:29

I tried to tell this story the way you would tell it to your friends.

Speaker 2: 22:33

Oh, I'm scared. You ready? Yeah.

Speaker 3: 22:36

So the Oregon Trail is 2, 170 miles. And it's a trek that starts from Independence, Missouri and goes through Carente, Kansas, Nebraska, Wyoming, Idaho, and Oregon.

Speaker 2: 22:49

It's just like, what is

Speaker 3: 22:52

all of that to the entire Pacific Northwest?

Speaker 2: 22:55

What's in between Massachusetts and California is my question. Like, how's it going? What's it, what's going on that way?

Speaker 3: 23:01

What are you guys up to?

Speaker 2: 23:03

I know Florida's down there and Texas is up down there.

Speaker 3: 23:06

You know the East Coast.

Speaker 2: 23:07

Yeah.

Speaker 3: 23:08

And one part of the West Coast is what you're telling me. Michigan's

Speaker 2: 23:10

up there, right? Because the lakes?

Speaker 3: 23:13

Yes.

Speaker 2: 23:13

Cool. Everything else? No, yeah.

Speaker 3: 23:15

Okay, great. So it took an average of four to five months. But a lot of people got delayed. It's on average. It's four to five, but we'll get into that

Speaker 2: 23:24

and they're just walking

Speaker 3: 23:26

Thousands of pioneers braved this trail in the mid 1800s to go west.

Speaker 2: 23:31

Okay,

Speaker 3: 23:32

going west brother What weren't

Speaker 2: 23:33

they liking about the east?

Speaker 3: 23:35

Oh, we'll get into it. Oh, sorry.

Speaker 2: 23:36

Sorry

Speaker 3: 23:37

So the u. s. As we know it today with all the states the 1550 United States for the 13 original colonies It is not that in the 1800s. So when I say Oregon country, that's because it's literally going to a different country. It's not broken up into states yet, and it covers Washington, Oregon, Idaho, parts of Montana, Wyoming, and British Columbia in Canada. So

Speaker 2: 23:56

it's just space. It's

Speaker 3: 23:57

fucking massive. It's huge. It's called Oregon country. I also, I get. Very self conscious about the way I say Oregon, because it's Oregon, but I say Oregon a lot. I don't know.

Speaker 2: 24:07

I didn't even know there was a difference. Yeah. I recently learned there's two Dakotas, so. There's a north and a south. Yeah, what the, they're fucking huge. What the fuck's over there? What is going on in Dakotas? Dakotas.

Speaker 3: 24:18

No, Rushmore? I don't fucking know. Okay, so the land is being disputed over by the British and the Americans. Of over who it belongs to. Can't

Speaker 2: 24:25

they stay in their own fucking country

Speaker 3: 24:27

plot, twist to make this very, very crystal clear at the top, it belongs to the indigenous people who live there. True. That's true. And have been there for a while, but we're a bunch of dicks. Okay. So just keep that in mind while we go through this story. We thought we were better. We weren't a hundred percent. We thought we were better. So it's the early 18 hundreds. We don't have maps. We understand sort of how the world is shaped because we have sailed it, but we do not have a roadmap of the United States.

Speaker 2: 24:54

But do you think there still were like the world of flat believers then?

Speaker 3: 24:58

Oh, for sure. For sure. For sure. We Don't really have a good idea of what else is going the fuck on in the West as you would say so remember these two Cute little men called Lewis and Clark. Oh, yeah. Yeah, so our president at the time Thomas Jefferson is like hey you two go out West Figure out how to make it easy We want to go east to west and we want to do it like a piece of cake and we want it to be for everybody.

Speaker 2: 25:20

Lay down the land.

Speaker 3: 25:21

Lay down the land, figure it out. So they're like, cool, cool. So they go out there where they're like, we're on it. They go for two years and they find a way but they use rivers because they're like, no one is out here trying to cross the Rocky Mountains. Like a straight vertical climb. Like picture where Whoville is, where the Grinch lives, straight up. So they're like, well, most humans can't cross that. This is impossible. So you gotta To

Speaker 2: 25:45

go around?

Speaker 3: 25:46

Oh, honey, no. It spans the whole Oh. It's large. I don't like that. It goes very far.

Speaker 2: 25:53

Was

Speaker 3: 25:53

this when they were in the wagons? They're in the wagons. That's correct. Yeah. So they find a way through rivers, but they're like, it's impossible. Your run of the mill person can't just like go from east to west. That's fucking crazy. But they find a way with the rivers and they come back and the first land route mapped out was from Lewis and Clark. So they gave us a good idea. They showed some Allen men. They're like, you know what? You guys feel like you're trained. You know how to do this. You can go West, but not everyone else can. Tis impossible. Then comes John Jacob Astor, who just makes me want to say John Jacob, jingle Harmer Smith. He is a New York businessman. He is obscenely wealthy. He is so fucking rich. He says, I want chains of trading posts through the route so that people can stop and get whatever they need. But he's like, I'm the money and the brains of this operation. I'm not fucking going out there and doing it. I'm going to hire a bunch of guys, all these mountain men, and you guys are going to do it. So he creates in 1808 the Pacific Fur Company to make these little trading posts through the route.

Speaker 2: 26:56

To sell what, like fur and corn?

Speaker 3: 26:59

You know, supplies, different types of things, Colleen. So the war breaks out in 1812, four years later, and it just puts the kibosh on the whole game plan.

Speaker 2: 27:08

The war of 1812?

Speaker 3: 27:10

Yes.

Speaker 2: 27:11

Okay. Yes, I know that one.

Speaker 3: 27:13

Sure. Great. Okay. As Aster's men make their way back to the United States, because like I said, it's different, kind of a different country,

Speaker 5: 27:20

they

Speaker 3: 27:22

are crossing and they're like, Oh my God, there is a gap in the Rockies that flattens out. Maybe this is capable if you are walking. Maybe people can do this. And the timing on this is important because a few years after the war, the U S and Britain decide to go halfsies on Oregon country, which that's always worked out. to just go halfsies when is that ever so I mean except for the indigenous people who are already there They're not even factored into the equation. It's either American or it's British the Brits pull up with the HPC not the head bitch in charge It's called the Hudson Bay Company

Speaker 5: 27:59

and they're

Speaker 3: 28:00

like we have arrived in Oregon country and Americans are like, oh hell nah If we want this territory eventually, we need to outnumber them. We need to get people out there ASAP. We need to overwhelm them. It needs to be majority us, but people are still not convinced. They're like, it's not really safe. These fur trader guys said it was, but like, I don't want to die.

Speaker 2: 28:21

Yeah. I don't know what's out there. I don't.

Speaker 3: 28:22

Right. Like, I don't want to go out there. I don't want to move. And of all the groups to go first, I do not think you have your money on who goes. Do you want to? Yeah. I guess.

Speaker 2: 28:33

I don't know. Like, is it like a type of person?

Speaker 3: 28:37

Yeah. Like

Speaker 2: 28:37

the women and children just leaving the charge? No,

Speaker 3: 28:40

no, no, no, no, no. No, they don't even think men can do this. Women are like the lowest on the totem pole. I have

Speaker 2: 28:45

no idea.

Speaker 3: 28:46

Okay. So in 1831, four Native Americans traveling the same route the fur traders came. They land in St. Louis and people are like, Oh my God, hey, what the fuck? What are you doing here? How did you get here? And one of the Native Americans says, quote, My people sent me to get the white man's book of heaven, end quote. Okay. Historians say that was never said. That just like straight up was a lie. However, it's printed as truth in New York's Christian Advocate Journal and missionaries begin going West.

Speaker 2: 29:18

Because God's leading them there? Because

Speaker 3: 29:20

the Native Americans need Jesus. Protestant missionaries are like, this is our time to shine. Native Americans need Christ. They're

Speaker 2: 29:27

calling for us.

Speaker 3: 29:28

Imagine, fucking imagine, because it's a group, they start a task force and they're like, we are going to create Methodist missionary in Oregon country, like we're going to set up shop. Just imagine being a Native American, right? Your entire family lineage has been one with the land. We're painting all the colors of the wind, right? This is my homeland. In a white man from New York shows up and knocks on your door and is like, you have a minute to hear about the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ?

Speaker 2: 29:55

Simply no.

Speaker 3: 29:56

Simply no. I would immediately murder them.

Speaker 2: 30:00

Do you think Jehovah's still do this? Do that at this day and age? Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Ugh, I hate that for them. Like, can't you like do email marketing or something?

Speaker 3: 30:09

Not in the 1800s. So this group heads out, they travel the path, and it ends up being the path that thousands and thousands of people will take after them. And they also have women! Gasp!

Speaker 2: 30:21

Interesting. Even

Speaker 3: 30:22

women! What? So one of the women, her name's Narcissa, she writes to her in laws, and she's like, this is easy peasy. This is a piece of fucking cake. And she says something to the effect of, This is easier than traveling on the turnpikes in the states. Ma'am, ma'am. If you've ever been on the Mass Pike.

Speaker 2: 30:40

That's not true. She's lying. You ever been on Storrow? You're lying.

Speaker 3: 30:44

I mean, Mass Pike now versus 1800s Oregon Trail. Maybe up for debate, but she is totally sugarcoating in underselling how fucking hard it is to get there. Spoiler alert It is not easy. The Oregon Trail is not fucking easy, especially early on. Okay? So missionaries are coming back and forth and they're like guys you're missing out. This is not mid. It's fire I literally hate myself.

Speaker 2: 31:08

Are they on the wagon or no? I don't get it. Like

Speaker 3: 31:11

are they walking?

Speaker 2: 31:12

Wagons. Wagons. Being pilled. Being pilled. Being pulled by. Oh,

Speaker 3: 31:15

we'll talk about it.

Speaker 2: 31:16

Okay, I just need a vision. I just need to like picture in my brain.

Speaker 3: 31:19

I do a whole What should we pack and what do we bring? Okay. Got

Speaker 2: 31:22

it. Got it. Got

Speaker 3: 31:23

it. So what this does it's

Speaker 2: 31:24

giving me Yeah,

Speaker 3: 31:25

is it inspires people to go West for three different reasons one. You've got your missionaries who are like The natives need Jesus, right? Then you've got people who are doing it for the good old red, white, and blue like this is our territory We need to outnumber the Brits. Yep, and then three you've got the economy in the fucking gutter It's the worst economic downturn until the Great Depression and people are Broke like people talk about not being able to afford eggs. We cannot afford eggs

Speaker 2: 31:55

How is moving to desolate land going to give us money?

Speaker 3: 31:57

New opportunity

Speaker 2: 31:59

Okay.

Speaker 3: 31:59

Plenty of farming and like at the time farming is a huge deal. That's why a lot of people are moving. This phrase manifest destiny is coined and it starts right after Texas is recognized as part of the US, which we went to war over, which we'll talk about in a bit.

Speaker 2: 32:13

The Alamo.

Speaker 3: 32:14

Yes.

Speaker 2: 32:14

Okay. Exactly. You talked about the Alamo earlier. I did tell you about the Alamo earlier. That's why I said that. Sorry gang.

Speaker 3: 32:19

And it was this mindset that America was in inevitably. going to spread west to the Pacific Ocean and it was like ours for the taking. Except for the indigenous people. But whatever, it was the land of opportunity for everyone. You could start fresh, start new. La dee da. Enter the Great Migration of 1843. Everyone's going west. People are like, let's fucking go. Okay, so this guy named Dr. Marcus Whitman is the guy, he's married to Narcissa. She's the one who wrote home and said this is easier than the Mass Pike. What did they name

Speaker 2: 32:48

Narcissa?

Speaker 3: 32:50

It's Narcissa Malfoy. Okay, sis. Sissy that one. He's heading home because they're getting their funding pulled for the missionaries and he's like, Oh, hell nah. And so he comes back and he pleads with the board to keep his funding, which they do. But what he does is he publishes this thing and he's like, Hey everybody, I'm going back to Oregon in the summer, and Americans should come with me, anyone who wants to come, because a lot of people were like, I don't know how to get there, I don't even know where to start. I'm not. I need a guide. I need a guide. And so?

Speaker 2: 33:22

Let's slay the trail away.

Speaker 3: 33:23

875 people, women, and children go with him, 120 wagons, and 3, 000 cattle. Yeah, so imagine taking your children across the Oregon Trail. I can't even imagine getting on a plane with a child, let alone being in the back of a wagon for five months on, when I say trail at this point, I use that very loosely. Like five people have gone down it. I'm being dramatic, but do you know what I mean? Like there, it's not a trail. It's not a path. No, it's not a path. It was not meant for humans to walk. Yet. Okay, so.

Speaker 4: 34:00

Talk about trailblazers. Oh, It is where the term comes from. So, Okay, let's talk about what people need to start this journey. You need about 600 during this time, 15, 000 now, and people are fucking broke, like Great Depression broke. People are prepping for years, saving up their money, liquidating every asset in every bank account they have to go on this. You need a wagon. So I'm not going west. You need at least one wagon. You need either horses, mules, or oxen. Oxen is preferred. You need cash, just in case you need a barter. You need tools and weapons and ammunition. You need proper clothing for multiple seasons and multiple pieces, you know, types of weather. You need enough food for everyone in the party. It's recommended that people bring 200 pounds of food per person.

Speaker 2: 34:53

Do they have non perishables? Like, I don't think they have cans. Do they have cans?

Speaker 3: 34:57

They have some stuff.

Speaker 2: 34:58

Okay. They have some stuff. Okay.

Speaker 3: 35:00

Food alone is 5, 000 a person.

Speaker 2: 35:02

Oh my god.

Speaker 3: 35:03

They need to bring medical supplies, in case anything happens. And they also need to bring extra shit for the wagon, because if the wagon breaks down, you are shit out of luck. So, spare tires, spare parts. Dude, what do these tires, axles, what

Speaker 2: 35:16

do these things look

Speaker 3: 35:18

like? Listen, and some people bring booze. Anyway. That's roughing it. Let's talk about life on the Oregon Trail. On a good day, the day starts at 4 a. m. when the men on guard fire their rifles as an alarm clock. The thousand plus cattle are corralled. And people start packing up their camps and their tents, and they eat breakfast about 6 to 7 a. m.

Speaker 5: 35:43

Okay.

Speaker 3: 35:43

Then they're on the road, and if you are not ready to roll by 7 a. m., you get to the back of the line with your wagon. People are like, fucking get to the back. We are not waiting for you. You're taking too long. We all have that friend who would get left behind. Let's be serious.

Speaker 2: 35:56

Mm hmm. They catch up though, no?

Speaker 3: 35:58

Eventually. Hunting parties are also writing off to like find extra meat for everyone, And then they head out on the trail and around noon, they sit down, they have lunch and at 1 p. m. a bugle will sound. That means All I can think about is the snack. Yeah, of course. That means it's time to get back on the trail and they do that for The whole rest of the day until the sun goes down. And then the head of the party makes the wagons kind of circle around each other. They have like a way to keep everyone together. Dinner is cooked. They eat. Men go on guard duty and sometimes someone will whip out a violin for some entertainment and kids will dance.

Speaker 2: 36:41

Oh,

Speaker 3: 36:42

life on the Oregon trail. Do

Speaker 2: 36:44

they bathe?

Speaker 3: 36:45

Mm. Probably in, like, rivers when they see them. That's great. However, many settlers looked at the Oregon Trail with this idealistic eye, right? Like, oh my god, look at all this opportunity, look at everything we can do. It was anything but romantic. According to the Oregon California Trails Association, almost 1 in 10 who embarked on this trail did not survive. Imagine getting onto an airplane. Hey everyone, uh, we are flying to San Francisco. Just so you know, one in 10 people on this plane will die by the time we get there.

Speaker 2: 37:17

No.

Speaker 3: 37:18

And it will take five months. I

Speaker 2: 37:20

nominate as tribute.

Speaker 3: 37:23

For real. One in ten. I saw one in twenty somewhere, but this is from History. com, so I'm going to trust History. com. I feel like

Speaker 2: 37:29

it just depended on the group.

Speaker 3: 37:31

Probably.

Speaker 2: 37:32

Honestly. Also, like, what if you got motion sickness? Like, there's no medication. Oh no,

Speaker 3: 37:38

you're, you are perishing for five straight months.

Speaker 2: 37:42

And you know they're like in petticoats, probably.

Speaker 3: 37:45

They're definitely not uncomfortable clothes. That is for sure. You

Speaker 2: 37:47

know what I mean?

Speaker 3: 37:47

Most people died of diseases such as dysentery, which is when you have bacteria in your body that you usually through dirty water you're shitting Bloody diarrhea.

Speaker 2: 37:57

I want nothing to do with that. Yeah.

Speaker 3: 37:59

Smallpox.

Speaker 2: 38:00

Do they have toilet paper?

Speaker 3: 38:01

Flu. I have no idea. I'm assuming they're just shitting in the woods. Old school. What

Speaker 2: 38:07

fucking woods? They're

Speaker 3: 38:09

on a trail. They're in nature.

Speaker 2: 38:11

Yeah, that's true. I was just thinking like hay bales, you know?

Speaker 3: 38:15

No, you need the hay. You need the hay to feed the animals and, I'm assuming, help with fires. You can't shit in the hay bales. My God, Colleen.

Speaker 5: 38:24

So many

Speaker 3: 38:25

accidents caused by inexperience, like people just accidentally shot themselves. Yeah, because they're not trained people. I'm not even trying to shoot. Who are we shooting? That's how you get food. Oh, right. You have your perishables, but you're trying to save those. So you want to get game, so it holds you over. Ew. Colleen, this is the reality. Ugh. Exhaustion. People just straight up died of exhaustion, which like, so relatable. In carelessness, like, there are a ton of people who died by getting crushed by the wagon. Like, getting rolled over.

Speaker 2: 38:58

It's not funny. It's, we can laugh about it now. It was like a million years ago.

39:00

It's, it's been a long fuckin time. Also thanks guys, America's Slang. Just kidding, America sucks. Anyways, um,,

Speaker 3: 39:09

some people drowned because there were lakes and rivers that you could cross if the water was shallow enough and they would just be in this lake and get scooped away and drown. There's so much shit that happens on the Oregon Trail. Why

Speaker 2: 39:20

are we going over huge bodies of water? With

Speaker 3: 39:22

wagons. In cattle. I don't. It's the only option. With

Speaker 2: 39:26

children. With

Speaker 3: 39:26

bebes. Travelers. In

Speaker 4: 39:30

a wooden wagon. They didn't even have plastic so they could light waves. What are you calling him?

Speaker 3: 39:37

Every single comfort that you know and love today, this is pre dating it. Travelers often left warning messages to those behind them so they would like carve it into a rock or they would like spike a like a note that says, you know, bad water.

Speaker 4: 39:55

It's giving Airbnb reviews.

Speaker 3: 39:57

Outbreak of disease or Do not

Speaker 2: 39:59

drink.

Speaker 3: 40:00

Yeah, please don't drink the water. You will have shitty diarrhea for until you die. You will

Speaker 2: 40:04

be

Speaker 3: 40:05

shittin You will be shit and then there is no Pepto Bismol, before you ask. Pepto Bismol is not a thing. I

Speaker 2: 40:11

feel like Pepto's not real.

Speaker 3: 40:13

So, there are other things that were going wrong, which were also hostile Native Americans, because you are traipsing through their home. And so there are a lot of really terrible stories of pioneers in Native Americans fighting and killing each other. And sometimes settlers would come and they would make a deal with the Native Americans and be like, hey, let's just agree upon this and we can all just have some peace. And then other settlers were coming and be like, well, I didn't make that deal. I'm not, I'm not abiding to a deal I never make. And then just kill them. And so Native Americans started like, stealing the children and holding them hostage. And then people were dying left, right, and center. And then we were just slowly pushing them onto reservations.

Speaker 2: 40:56

It's not giving Kumbaya.

Speaker 3: 40:57

It's not giving peace. That is for sure. We are not painting with all the colors of the wind. It is not just around the riverbend. It's just shitty. So, okay. So there are a bunch of different trails. They lead to different states. It gained such popularity that it wasn't uncommon for thousands of people to be on multiple Oregon trails at the same time. Like, people are bumping through these trails.

Speaker 2: 41:23

Okay,

Speaker 3: 41:24

so I'm going to tell you about one of the most famous ones stories of the Oregon Trail. Lanceford W Hastings is a complete fucking douche canoe.

Speaker 5: 41:32

Okay.

Speaker 3: 41:33

He is an Ohio born lawyer. He had been on a previous expedition through the Oregon Trail and he's very ambitious. He's in Oregon. He's like, this is places and doing for me. I want fame. I want glory. I want to be known. Because he wants to make this name for himself, he's like, I'm not only going to do the Oregon Trail, but I'm also going to do Oregon to California.

Speaker 5: 41:52

Okay. And say,

Speaker 3: 41:52

fuck these bitches. Overachiever. And so he writes a book called The Immigrant's Guide to Oregon in California and it's a do it yourself that helps pioneers know what to expect, what to pack, what trails to take, etc. He mentions that there's a supposed shortcut on the trail and he even gives like some vague directions of like, oh, when you're at this point, it's 200 yards that way or whatever. The problem with this is he has absolutely no idea what the fuck he's talking about because he has never taken the shortcuts. He has no, he does not know what that shortcut entails. This book is a hit and a bunch of fucking people buy it

Speaker 2: 42:25

and they probably die.

Speaker 3: 42:27

Meanwhile, in May of 1846, a large party set off from Missouri with the intent on traveling to California. It's actually late to leave, so you want to leave for the Oregon Trail in April. And the thought process behind this is, you know it's going to take four to five months, you know you have to travel in a wagon, you want to miss rainy spring season so that the wagon's wheels don't get stuck in the mud, and you also want to avoid winter. So you want to travel through the spring and into the summer. L Fall vis, so like May

Speaker 2: 42:55

Flowers, April Showers bring May Flowers.

Speaker 3: 42:57

Yes. So April, maybe May. So they leave in May. For whatever reason, the group has Hastings book and they intend to take the shortcut because they're trying to get to California asap and they bump into a guy named James Kliman. James Kle. Okay, so in this group is this guy named James Reed, okay? Okay,

Speaker 5: 43:15

James. James

Speaker 3: 43:16

R Reed and James Clyman know each other. They were soldiers together and were like on the battlefield together. Okay. So they're like, oh hey, what's up? And James Clyman knows Hastings. Is like, ah, I'm a buddy of his, I actually did the Oregon Trail with him. Okay. And James Reed is like, Clyman, we're trying to do his shortcut. And Clyman is like, soldier to soldier, under no fucking circumstances should you do that trail. He doesn't know what he's talking about. I be knowing

Speaker 2: 43:39

the truth.

Speaker 3: 43:40

He doesn't know what he's talking about, number one, and number two, it is barely possible when you follow the trails of the wagon, let alone when you go fucking off roading. And James Reid is like, sorry bro, not happening, we're doing the shortcut, we're trying to get there faster. M'kay, brother. So Hastings, just being a colossal dickwad, writes a letter to all of these people, and he's like, hey gang, I'm on the road right now, but If you get to that lovely shortcut that I've never been on, he, he like went down, but he walked it. He didn't use a wagon. No, he's like, I'll meet you and personally escort you. So all these people who are like on the fence are like, okay, well, now we have the guy who wrote the book and has done this shortcut so many times. We'll just meet him there. So, So is he just gonna like play pretend like

Speaker 2: 44:29

he's been there? Oh, you just wait.

Speaker 3: 44:31

It's so much worse. The group splits.

Speaker 2: 44:33

Okay.

Speaker 3: 44:34

And half of the group is like, we're not interested, we're going the wagon route, we're going the one, you know, the road literally traveled before. In the shortcut group, elect George Donner as their leader, official becoming the Donner Party. Have you ever heard of the Donner Party?

Speaker 5: 44:49

Oh, interesting.

Speaker 3: 44:50

So, if you listen to True Crime at all, you know where this is going. I'm gonna keep it super high level, but you cannot talk about the Oregon Trail without talking about the Donner Party. So, they're behind schedule, but they're excited. They head out for California. They get to the meet up point. They get to the shortcut. Hastings left without them. He just bounced. Which is not a great start. Isn't

Speaker 2: 45:10

that the whole point? Like you're, you're there to show the squad.

Speaker 3: 45:13

But they're already so bought in. They're just like, we're going to make it work. So they still have the opportunity to go on the regular trail, but they don't. And at this point, when they take the shortcut, there are 87 people in the group. They follow Hastings tracks blindly. He's never done it with a wagon. It is not a trail. Six days later, Hastings leaves a note at a steep canyon and he's like, Hey gang, so this part you're not going to be able to do. But I'm way ahead of you, so send some messengers to come grab me and I'll circle back. And I'll come grab you and I will point you in the right direction. Because it's so rocky and it's so shitty and it's not a trail. So that's what they do. They, the group stays. They send a couple people on horseback. They get lost. They get injured. They can't find him. They finally bump into him and he's like, LOL JK, I'm not turning around. That's crazy. I refuse. You're crazy. He brings one of the guys. to just like a high spot and he just points out like you should go over there and then after that you should turn there and then go over there like with his finger he's just like go there go there go

Speaker 2: 46:15

there oh perfect

Speaker 3: 46:16

and the person he's explaining it to has absolutely no idea what he's fucking talking about And then Hastings just continues on and they go back and this guy with zero experience with trails is like I will guide the rest of the party through this. They make their way on a trail that doesn't exist. There's no road. They have to hack their way through because of the heavy underbrush. There were just whole asterisks in the way that wagons couldn't get around. Twelve days later, the

Speaker 2: 46:45

wagons,

Speaker 3: 46:46

they get to Salt Lake Valley. this is a, a brief piece of luck that will run out so fast you won't even believe it. But they have water and they have grass for the animals because the cattle has to fucking eat and they just are like we're gonna rest up because we're about to cross the desert. There's a note from Hastings that is like if you push forward and you just ride for two days straight for two days and two nights, you'll be on the other side of it. No problem. Three days later, they're still in the desert. Animals are giving out. People are giving out. Some people are abandoning completely and hiking out of the desert on foot. They're passing out left and right. It's so frigid cold at night in the desert, it starts pouring rain. They lose a ton of their cattle, which means they have nothing to pull the wagons, so they have to abandon the wagons, but they have to bring all of the stuff because it has, I don't know, their food and water in every single fucking thing they brought, so they're carrying it on their backs, but they're all dehydrated because they're in the desert and they're running out of water. It gets worse. They keep moving. And they get on the other side of the desert, they bump into the main trail. I, the way in which this is such adding insult to injury, the main group had passed them days and days and days ago. The quote unquote shortcut added 125 miles. They were on the trail for 68 days, the main group was on for 37. It doubled the amount of time and they did not pack enough things. I think I would just die right there. I think I would just be like, just leave me. Just leave me here. So tensions are high.

Speaker 2: 48:23

The minute we have to start hacking things, I'm out.

Speaker 3: 48:25

Yeah, people are starving. They're dehydrated. They start to blame James Reed because he picked the stupid fucking route. They're running out of supplies. There's a fight that breaks out. James Reed, unfortunately, stabs A man to death and there are no laws because they're literally in the middle of fucking nowhere territory Where maybe the brits own it? Maybe the americans own it. We don't fucking know. No, we

Speaker 2: 48:45

do know who owns it And it's but there's no

Speaker 3: 48:47

law. There's no like police to come and get him. They exile him They're like see you later his wife his kids all there. He gets exiled. He ends up being fine He goes on he finds another group group and he gets to california just fine The way his family did not fare as well. So people start going missing. You will fucking hate this part. There was an older man. No, he was holding up the group and they left him for dead. They were like, you are just taking too long and you are slowing us down. And they were just like, peace in sped up and left him to die. the native Americans are stealing all their cattle in the middle of the night because they don't have the strength to keep, so they're just losing wagons by the day. It's. horrible. It's also getting cold because now we're in the fall. So they decide to rest at the base of a mountain instead of powering through and they rest for 10 days and this ends up being the worst idea.

Speaker 2: 49:42

Why do you need 10 days of rest?

Speaker 3: 49:44

I mean, they have nothing. They have nothing in the gas tank. We're just

Speaker 2: 49:47

wasting more. So

Speaker 3: 49:48

it's the end of October. They took off in May. They were supposed to be there by September. It's the end of October. No

Speaker 2: 49:57

one on the other side has been like, Hey, we were expecting them a while ago.

Speaker 3: 50:00

Oh yeah, that ends up happening. Everyone is fighting for their lives. They have one more push over the mountains because they're told that the pass that they're in, the mountain pass, will get them snowed in.

Speaker 5: 50:11

Great.

Speaker 3: 50:11

It is now called the Donner Pass. And some of the group breaks because everyone's fighting all of the time. There's so much internal conflict that the Donner's wagon breaks and they go to fix it and George Donner, the dad, Slices his hand open and they're just like we need to just stay here and figure our shit out And so half the party keeps going half stays so they're in like two separate locations, but like relatively close to each other Okay, it starts to snow and it doesn't stop snowing Like I said, this is the end of October,

Speaker 2: 50:46

right? They can't watch the news to find out the weather.

Speaker 3: 50:48

Correct. The last of the Donner party would get rescued in April. What? Yeah, they sent three different groups of people to go out and save the Donner party. The first one gets there. They find. It's people who are starved to death. They have nothing. Kids are eating the rug. It is so bad. The second group that gets sent out gets stranded from snow. So they had to send a third party to go get the donner party and the stranded second party. Jesus Christ. And a lot of them. Gave up their children. So like a lot of these kids were orphaned because the parents are like if you're gonna save anyone It's got to be our kids And so they would give them as much supplies as possible and send them on their merry way But they had no food. And so if you know the Donner Party and like I said, I'm not gonna go into it There is one word that pops up anywhere you look and that is cannibalism So that is what they resort to I will keep it at that. It's very, uh, Chilean rugby, plane accident, survival of the motherfucking fetus. Like this is as, as bad as it gets. So that is the Donner party. And that's in April. That's so the last person gets saved in April. The group that went to go rescue them. The first one was in February though. So three whole months. Yeah. And they, they packed for four to five months. They left in May. Okay. The last person got saved 11 months later. Like they have nothing. They have nothing.

Speaker 2: 52:15

How have they just not died?

Speaker 3: 52:17

Like they do. So of the 87 people, 48 are the only ones who survived and some people lost their entire families.

Speaker 2: 52:25

I don't

Speaker 3: 52:25

love this for them. No, no. The Oregon trail is fucking brutal and they didn't have a guide and they followed some stupid asshole who like didn't even write the truth. It's just, it's all bad. So that's one trail. But over time conditions obviously start to improve. There are bridges, so it makes traveling over bodies of water much safer. Oh, so

Speaker 2: 52:45

they can just build bridges now? They still have these fucking wagons?

Speaker 3: 52:49

Settlements and additional supply posts appear along the way, which give weary travelers a place to rest, to regroup, to get what they need. Trail guidebooks get better and more detailed. Like, the maps get better because people are doing it more. So settlers no longer even have to have a guide or an escort. They can just Do the journey on their own. And although we learned from douchebag Hastings, you shouldn't really do that. It, it does get better. The paths get more worn down. So people are like, Oh, I'm obviously going in the right direction. These were all the wagon wheels are going. Do you know what I mean? This will set the tone for the growth of the American West. A man named Brigham Young will lead a group of Latter day Saints, AKA Mormons, through the trail. They actually, they do, Yes, Salt Lake City, that's exactly where they go. And they actually, not the first group, they send a bunch of groups out, but one of the next groups takes the exact same path as the Donner Party, because now it's called the Hastings Cutoff, is a trail now. But then it wasn't. The California Gold Rush happens. A man named James W. Marshall literally strikes gold in Sacramento Valley, California. Finds gold. Once news hits, people are coming left, right, fucking center. Everybody and their mother is estimated two thirds of the male population in Oregon went to California in 1848.

Speaker 2: 54:08

That's crazy.

Speaker 3: 54:08

And it was a rush because people wanted to capitalize on it while it was still fresh and they didn't want the market to be saturated. So it is literally a gold rush. It is said that by the end of 1849, the population in this area went from 1, 000 people to 100, 000 people.

Speaker 2: 54:25

That's 90,

Speaker 3: 54:26

000 people. Men from all over the country are hauling ass to get out there. They usually were taking less than less than safer routes because they were just everyone is so fucking poor. And they just want a piece of the pie. Mm. They just want to prosper. And then they just killed their way through indigenous people to get there. It's just all bad. So, you know the NFL team, the San Francisco 49 ERs Mm-Hmm. Gold Miners in 1849. So, because 49 was the peak of it. The, the gold rush, they're the 49 ERs. That's what the gold miners were called. Okay. So that's why the team is called that we figure our shit out with Britain. We take the Pacific Northwest and they get Canada. We had been in an all out war with Mexico over Texas that got very fucked up, but we signed a treaty that ended this war in favor of the U. S. And we add 525, 000 square miles to the U. S., which is present day Arizona, California, Colorado, Nevada, New Mexico, Utah, and California. And Wyoming. Fucking huge. Like the Wide

Speaker 2: 55:29

open

Speaker 3: 55:30

spaces! This is legit how we got the continental U. S.

Speaker 2: 55:33

That's crazy. Isn't that

Speaker 3: 55:34

fucking crazy? And so I think History. com sums it up best. So this is what they say. Despite the lofty idealism of Manifest Destiny, the rapid territorial expansion over the first half of the 19th century resulted not only in war with in dislocation and brutal mistreatment of Native American, Hispanic and other non European occupants of the territories now being occupied by the United States. U. S. expansion also fueled the growing debate over slavery by raising the pressing question of whether new states being admitted into the union would allow slavery or not. This conflict would eventually lead to the Civil War. In the U. S. And so, Woof. the trail calmed down a bit. We started using ferries that used more popular ports, and then we of course got railroads, and then planes, and cars, and now you can hop on a six hour flight instead of starving to death for six months. And be there by the end of the day, today. Talk about

Speaker 2: 56:30

zero to a hundred.

Speaker 3: 56:32

Yeah. And so, before PlayStation and Nintendo, you played video games on your computer. That was the only way to play. And there was this computer game called the Oregon Trail. And it was all the fucking rage. Like, if you know any elder millennial, they are like, I am obsessed with the Oregon Trail. It was designed for eighth graders to understand life along the trail and you could like be a pioneer. And so I played it.

Speaker 2: 56:56

You could be a pioneer.

Speaker 3: 56:58

But do you know what I mean? Like you can pick where you're from, you're get, you're given a certain amount of money. You have to go to a store and pack food and clothes and ammunition and all this stuff. And there's this famous line, cause you can die. It's just like Mario, like when you jump down a thing and it's like end of life kind of thing. Got it. There's this famous line that says, you have died of dysentery. And so people wear it on t shirts, like it's like this iconic thing. And so you can still play it. Like I said, I did it. You can play it on your, your computer. And I also just was curious at how many people were dying and like what from. The number one reason people died on the Oregon Trail was disease. So anywhere between 6, 000 and 12, 500. This is based off of Wikipedia. Native American attacks. We're second. Next up, freezing, scurvy.

Speaker 2: 57:45

What's scurvy?

Speaker 3: 57:46

So scurvy, we actually looked up the other day because we couldn't stop laughing because we think Colleen has scurvy. It's a rare reversible condition caused by a lack of vitamin C in the diet for at least a few months and it's like weakness, muscle pain, bruising, and rash, but it's also just like depression. Yeah, it's like, are you feeling irritable and sad all the time? You may have scurvy. You see that lack of light in your eyes? So if you have scurvy, you know that that might be what it is. People getting run over, drownings, shootings, and my all time favorite, miscellaneous. And that is

Speaker 2: 58:23

getting run over by the wagons kills me.

Speaker 3: 58:25

Well, and people brought guns like they were going to hunt. They've never hunted a day in their life. They're like from Boston. And when you have gunpowder and it rains, that gunpowder is useless. There were so many people on this trail that should not had no fucking business being on this trail now I heard that some people like fell in love on the trail I heard a horrible story about how a woman gave birth on the trail like in the back of the wagon Why are you

Speaker 2: 58:51

fucking on the trail, but

Speaker 3: 58:51

there's no It's so rocky that people had to like hold the wagon down after someone has just given birth like absolutely kill me And then I heard a story that people would get married and do it as their honeymoon. And I was like, I would actually rather die of scurvy. Also, we all just have like that hippie friend who would do it. We all have that friend who would be like, what a journey to be part of nature.

Speaker 2: 59:16

I would do it. Megan. My friend Megan would do that. Megan. She listens to every episode. That's the only reason why I said Megan. Oh my gosh, Megan.

Speaker 3: 59:21

Tell us if you would do the Oregon Trail. I want to know. Megan

Speaker 2: 59:23

would go on the Oregon Trail. So

Speaker 3: 59:23

yeah, that's the Oregon Trail. And the expansion of America to the West. Did you learn something today? Yeah, I

Speaker 2: 59:29

learned all that. I learned all of that. I think I skipped that year in school. No. Or that lesson.

Speaker 3: 59:36

I mean you honestly knowing your history and what was taught at those schools you probably just straight up didn't get it.

Speaker 2: 59:44

Probably. Maybe

Speaker 3: 59:45

when you were in elementary school but They definitely weren't telling you about dysentery. I mean, maybe they were. I don't know.

Speaker 2: 59:51

I don't know. I didn't retain much clearly. But yeah, that was really good. That was very informative. I

Speaker 3: 59:56

hope informative but not boring. No. It's kind of my aim.

Speaker 2: 59:58

Not in the slightest. I think any sort of conversation regarding scurvy and dysentery is interesting.

Speaker 3: 1:00:04

So here, and I'll post a picture of this map. So this is one of the Oregon trails. This is the Hastings Cutoff, the hashtag shortcut. Yeah. Instead of going up to go back down, but this is not a trail. So even though it looks like you're cutting through and you're going to save all this time, this is already carved out for you. And this is desert. Rocky is just impassable.

Speaker 2: 1:00:30

Hmm. Okay. Does that make sense? They seem really fucking stupid for that, but

Speaker 3: 1:00:35

I was there. So who am I to say? I was going to say. I honestly, I blame Hastings because him writing to them and being like, gang, I will personally escort you. And then when they get there and they're like, wait, where is he? I probably would have ended it there. It was probably a sign that things weren't going well when your guide, who's the only person who has ever done this quote unquote trail. is just no shows you.

Speaker 2: 1:00:58

We should have done like a character check on him first. Like a little verification.

Speaker 3: 1:01:02

But back then if it was written in a book, it was published and that made it true.

Speaker 2: 1:01:06

Scary thoughts. Scary.

Speaker 3: 1:01:08

And now you can just hop on a plane, train, or automobile and get to the Wow Wow West!

Speaker 2: 1:01:13

Fifteen! Ten miles on the Erie Canal. What the fuck? I don't know, that's the only We learned about the Erie Canal in like the 5th grade, and that's the song we sang.

Speaker 3: 1:01:23

Oh, love that for you.

Speaker 2: 1:01:24

Yeah.

Speaker 3: 1:01:25

My sources for today were You History, that doesn't suck, a podcast. I listen to episode 30 and 31. It's hosted by Greg Jackson. I used a ton of history. com articles all over the place and Wikipedia.

Speaker 2: 1:01:39

Okay, so shout out Wikipedia. We'd be nowhere without you. I

Speaker 3: 1:01:41

know, history and Wikipedia are really, really keeping me alive.

Speaker 2: 1:01:44

How is it that Wikipedia is the most controversial in terms of sources but also the most used?

Speaker 3: 1:01:50

That is a really good question, Colleen. I think we should ponder that and circle back.

Speaker 2: 1:01:55

Okay. Sam. Or run that back.

Speaker 3: 1:01:57

Yeah, run that back Do you have a giggle for us?

Speaker 2: 1:02:00

I do have a giggle. Yay! I went through a rabbit hole of a thread. So here I am, yet again. Also falling out of the category of like, things people Hid from their spouses until they got married and like character traits.

Speaker 3: 1:02:13

Oh, okay. So a

Speaker 2: 1:02:14

mix of both.

Speaker 3: 1:02:14

Okay, great

Speaker 2: 1:02:15

Like things that you're like, how did this person hide this from me? But also like oh you've been hiding that that you do that and now it's it's out about now that we're married right. So anyhow, my first one is he told me he was in the military. I had recently enlisted. I'm assuming that it just says heat. Like it's just like your husband, your boyfriend. I don't fucking know. I had recently enlisted in the army when I met him out one night. He told me he was a Marine veteran and that's how we started talking. He told me stories about his time overseas and how he still keeps in touch with his military buddies. We eventually got married two years later. Okay. That clarifies it. And when I applied for a VA loan under his name, I got a letter from the That said that they had no record of him ever being in the military.

Speaker 3: 1:02:54

Oh, brutal.

Speaker 2: 1:02:56

He fabricated the entire thing. He would constantly ask for military discounts and tell elaborate war stories to people while wearing old military clothes. He started yelling at me when I confronted him about all the lies, and now we are divorced.

Speaker 3: 1:03:10

A ma zing. No. There are people who actually serve this country who deserve those discounts and have earned those war stories that probably haunt their nightmares. That's disgusting behavior. You fucking piece of shit. He actually should Disgusting behavior. That's someone who's not well. That's jail time. That's, get arrested. Immediately. On the spot. On site.

Speaker 2: 1:03:29

Is that like defamation or something?

Speaker 3: 1:03:32

Can we just use

Speaker 2: 1:03:32

that?

Speaker 3: 1:03:33

No, not, not that one. It's liar, liar, pants on fire. That's the law.

Speaker 2: 1:03:39

Lock him up! Lock him up! My best friend was engaged for a year and was with the guy for five years before that. She found out less than a month before her wedding that he had planned to kill his ex wife. Mother of his child. After she married someone else, he had gone up to the mountains where they were having their honeymoon, like the ex wife and the new man. Sure. Where they were having their honeymoon and camped out with a scoped rifle just up the hill from their cabin. He spent an entire week Are you

Speaker 3: 1:04:06

fucking kidding me?

Speaker 2: 1:04:07

He spent an entire week watching them, planning on killing them, if he got the chance. He couldn't bring himself to do it, so he left after they did. He revealed this to me.

Speaker 3: 1:04:16

Oh my god, that's, that's absolutely terrifying. What are you doing? That is actually a crime.

Speaker 2: 1:04:20

Like, what the fuck do you do? Someone you completely thought was a different character that you're like, holding. You go

Speaker 3: 1:04:25

to the police.

Speaker 2: 1:04:27

That's so upsetting. That's

Speaker 3: 1:04:28

wicked fucking upsetting.

Speaker 2: 1:04:29

My ex wife hid the fact that she stole my social security number and information and got school loans in my name for nursing school. As soon as she graduated, she blindsided me with divorce and left me with my dog. Oh, and left with my dog. I really miss my dog, but my ex can go fuck herself. The entire time we were married, I stupidly thought she was paying for school with her mom's money and grants.

Speaker 3: 1:04:50

That's also a crime. These people are criminals. That's

Speaker 2: 1:04:53

a whole ass crime, correct.

Speaker 3: 1:04:54

These people are just straight up fucking Maniacal criminals.

Speaker 2: 1:04:58

Uh, moving on. It was revealed to me after marriage that my husband would bite his nails and drop the little pieces all over the apartment. He moved out six months ago, but I'm still finding fingernail bits in weird places. That's the fucking

Speaker 3: 1:05:10

grossest thing I've ever heard. Isn't it crazy how hair attached to your body and nails attached to your body aren't gross, but the moment one of those leaves your body it's disgusting? I,

Speaker 2: 1:05:20

I don't like hair because I don't like the feeling of it, but I don't find nails gross.

Speaker 3: 1:05:23

Nails and hair to me, unacceptable. Unless they're in the trash. Away from my eyes. So fucking gross. Oh

Speaker 2: 1:05:31

my god, another one along those lines. It was revealed to me, when he pops a pimple, he puts the contents on the frame of the mirror. I Colleen, I don't know if I have the strength

Speaker 3: 1:05:43

for this.

Speaker 2: 1:05:44

No, but like, what if someone revealed this to you? You have to think of legs. What would you keep going? He puts the contents of the pimple on the frame of the mirror to quote unquote, see it and then forgets to clean it off. Sometimes his

Speaker 3: 1:05:55

puss.

Speaker 2: 1:05:56

Yeah. I didn't understand what the white specks were at first. This has since stopped after it sent me into a blind rage. I would hope so. I would leave this. That's grounds to leave this. Are people

Speaker 3: 1:06:06

raised in a fucking, or were you raised on the Oregon trail? Like, what are you doing? I don't

Speaker 2: 1:06:11

know. I, you know what I did see though? I saw a couple of them that were like, they, my significant other, I didn't know they did this until we lived together or like we're married, whatever, that they rip their contacts out and just kind of like throw them and we just find like crusty, I do that. I

Speaker 3: 1:06:25

know you do.

Speaker 2: 1:06:25

So I was like, it's really, I think that's only jarring to people who don't have contacts.

Speaker 3: 1:06:29

No, that's gross. Period.

Speaker 2: 1:06:32

Well, people do it, clearly. Period. Other than me.

Speaker 3: 1:06:34

Loofahs. Gross. Period.

Speaker 2: 1:06:37

I like my loofah.

Speaker 3: 1:06:38

It has so much bacteria on it, so keep watching your dirty ass body with it, bitch. You'll get what's coming to you. I barely

Speaker 2: 1:06:45

wash. It's okay.

Speaker 3: 1:06:46

Have you washed since the last time I saw you?

Speaker 2: 1:06:48

Yeah, I washed earlier. Okay, great. Because I went to class. So I had to wash.

Speaker 3: 1:06:52

Oh, we're back. We're back at it.

Speaker 2: 1:06:54

Yeah. She said we can't put the heat on in here today I said, thank you.

Speaker 3: 1:06:56

Thank god. Yeah,

Speaker 2: 1:06:57

I know I would have died that

Speaker 3: 1:06:58

fucking place

Speaker 2: 1:06:59

Anyways, this one's gonna be very upsetting for you.

Speaker 3: 1:07:01

Oh, no, this was supposed to be a giggle

Speaker 2: 1:07:04

I think it's hilarious

Speaker 4: 1:07:08

Oh my god It was revealed to me that he liked to tear holes in the sheets with his toenails so he could tuck his feet into them You guys can't see her face, but she's so troubled

Speaker 3: 1:07:24

I have no words. I'm too stunned to speak.

Speaker 4: 1:07:26

You wake up in the night and you're like, scratch, scratch, scratch.

Speaker 3: 1:07:32

That's so grotesque.

Speaker 2: 1:07:34

Have you ever had toenails that, like, you knew they were long because they were scratching on things? Or no?

Speaker 3: 1:07:38

Well, I've been with someone who's like, oh my god, he's like, you gotta, what the fuck? I'm like, ooh, sorry,

Speaker 2: 1:07:44

pedicure tomorrow. I was just saying, good morning, scratchy scratch.

Speaker 3: 1:07:47

Scratchy scratch.

Speaker 2: 1:07:48

My ex husband used to suck his thumb. I caught him doing it one night and it was so bizarre seeing this big man covered in tattoos sucking his thumb. The mother of that, that man? Jail time. Both of them.

Speaker 3: 1:07:59

Go. Immediately. Immediately. Exile. Like James Reed.

Speaker 2: 1:08:05

My late husband didn't tell me until the day after we were engaged that his parents were practicing nudists and that the cabin they always talked about was they were going to was at a nudist reserve.

Speaker 3: 1:08:16

Okay, that kind of sounds fun. They sound like a good time. I'm not gonna lie. And not that I would visit, but they're vibing.

Speaker 2: 1:08:22

I would visit. That sounds, like, interesting.

Speaker 3: 1:08:24

No, not with your in laws. You wouldn't be just out here, lips to the wind, in front of your in laws. Do you

Speaker 2: 1:08:29

want to see your future father in law's wean?

Speaker 3: 1:08:31

No.

Speaker 2: 1:08:31

His little

Speaker 3: 1:08:32

wang? Flopping around. But I love that for them, you know?

Speaker 2: 1:08:36

I guess. Do you know that they're, like, really real? Like, there's some in New Hampshire. Yeah, yes. Newest colonies. Like, I just always thought they were, like, a figment of, like, television.

Speaker 3: 1:08:44

No.

Speaker 2: 1:08:45

That's crazy. Okay. I kind of love it. That's all. Okay. Great. Anyways, this one's fucked up. Sorry. Her mother was interfering in our marriage constantly. I had an appointment with a lawyer to talk over options for divorce because I couldn't stand it anymore. Then her mother died suddenly of a heart attack. After her funeral, after her funeral, after her funeral, I sound like Jojo Siwa. After the funeral, things got better and here we are married now for three decades. She doesn't need to know.

Speaker 3: 1:09:13

He did it?

Speaker 2: 1:09:14

No, like that he went to a divorce, like he was full ass going to get a divorce and then she died and he was like, okay, nevermind. Like, that's crazy.

Speaker 3: 1:09:22

I mean, kind of a relief, I guess. Yeah,

Speaker 2: 1:09:24

that's like fucked up though. That

Speaker 3: 1:09:26

is wicked fucked up.

Speaker 2: 1:09:27

But she had no idea that you had, what your intentions were at one point. Yeah. Until your mother croaked and all was well. Like, that's crazy! Let's all go

Speaker 3: 1:09:33

back to normal!

Speaker 2: 1:09:37

Ding dong,

Speaker 3: 1:09:37

the witch is dead.

Speaker 2: 1:09:38

It's the context of him saying it to like the significant other. Remember when we were engaged and visited your dying mother in the hospital on hospice, and she let a fart out so rank that your eyes watered and we talked about it for 20 years? That was actually me. So it's like something I've never told, like, not done.

Speaker 3: 1:09:52

Okay, that's a good one. That's hilarious. That's really funny.

Speaker 2: 1:09:59

Early on in our relationship, I made breakfast for my then girlfriend and her kids using some pancake mix she had in the pantry. After mixing the pancakes and s Pancakes and serving them I went to mix up a little bit more after they had eaten to make my own And I realized that there were some maggots in the dry mix

Speaker 3: 1:10:13

you you they

Speaker 2: 1:10:15

were pretty much done eating already and telling me how Good, they were so I decided that ignorance was bliss and I did not tell them that's

Speaker 3: 1:10:21

fucking Disgusting taking that

Speaker 2: 1:10:23

one to my grave, but that's he couldn't help that. That's not his fault. He didn't see it.

Speaker 3: 1:10:28

That's fucking disgusting

Speaker 2: 1:10:29

Yeah,

Speaker 3: 1:10:31

they could get oh gross gross gross gross gross gross The last one I have, this is

Speaker 2: 1:10:37

the last one

Speaker 4: 1:10:38

I have,

Speaker 2: 1:10:39

The reason I lost my boner that one time in the 69 position, not the year is in parentheses, not the year. Yeah, no,

Speaker 3: 1:10:45

no, we're, we're understanding. We're all on the same page. We understand.

Speaker 2: 1:10:48

Was because a piece of toilet paper, paper fell in my eye from her butt. And then it says, Edit. Thank you so much for the awards. My first platinum is about toilet paper falling in my eye. I have no idea what they're referring to, but that's funny either way. To add some details, we do have a bidet, and the toilet paper was probably from the paper she used to dry herself after the bidet, so no pink eye for me. We have been married now for 13 years, and, uh, We have been together now for 13 years, and have been married for almost two years, and I never told her.

Speaker 3: 1:11:15

Okay. I have no notes. That man deserves to be married.

Speaker 2: 1:11:18

Yeah.

Speaker 3: 1:11:20

Wow.

Speaker 2: 1:11:21

Just like a little.

Speaker 3: 1:11:23

I thought you were going to be like, women who hide their target bags from their husbands to make sure they don't know that they went shopping.

Speaker 2: 1:11:28

Oh, no. You're like. No. I was actually going to divorce you and then your mother corrupts and then we were cool. So I never told you. There was a lot of like, I found all these things prior to our proposal and like, there was like a bunch of shit like that, but I'm like, boring. You knew you get engaged. Cool. Great.

Speaker 3: 1:11:46

Yeah. No, that one's lame.

Speaker 2: 1:11:47

Yeah. Stopping such a snoop. I would do.

Speaker 3: 1:11:50

I need to know things. So I always go back and forth about whether you should live with someone before you get married or after. They say I want to live with them before. Some people are really dead set though of not. I need to know what weird ass thing that you do though. I have to know and there's only one way to know and that is to live with someone.

Speaker 2: 1:12:07

And everyone does something weird. In their truest, comfortable, vulnerable form, you do something weird.

Speaker 3: 1:12:12

I'm trying to think of something weird I do. What do you do? I mean you do a lot of weird shit. I'm sure I do something weird.

Speaker 2: 1:12:20

Weird also, like, comes to the line of annoying. Like, things that you just do that are just, like, irritating to live with.

Speaker 3: 1:12:25

Oh, I talk way too much. I'm definitely going to drive someone crazy with how much I talk.

Speaker 2: 1:12:29

Yeah, for sure.

Speaker 3: 1:12:30

Yeah.

Speaker 2: 1:12:30

But you sit in silence on the couch, though.

Speaker 3: 1:12:32

I can sit in silence.

Speaker 2: 1:12:33

Yeah, you're comfortable with silence. But I love

Speaker 3: 1:12:34

an icebreaker.

Speaker 2: 1:12:35

Ew.

Speaker 3: 1:12:36

Do you know what I mean? I'm always

Speaker 2: 1:12:38

saying like, let's do an icebreaker or I love an icebreaker. Makes me actually want to die.

Speaker 3: 1:12:41

See, here's the thing. That's because the word icebreaker has a negative connotation. I love them. They save me in social interactions. I'm not kidding you. You would not believe I had someone text me. Why do you need to be

Speaker 2: 1:12:52

saved in social interaction? Why don't you just leave?

Speaker 3: 1:12:54

Because I love people. I want to get to know them.

Speaker 2: 1:12:57

I'm just being mean. Sorry. I ask

Speaker 3: 1:12:58

questions all the time. I'm just like, what type of potato is your favorite? Or. If you could see any bands living or dead, who would it be? Or, what decade would you live in if you could? I just asked and ran, I just want to know these things. What's your death row meal? What's your favorite condiment? I have so many questions. Okay. So I think that would drive someone fucking nuts.

Speaker 2: 1:13:18

Yeah, I would agree.

Speaker 3: 1:13:20

Alright, your turn, bitch.

Speaker 2: 1:13:22

I mean, I definitely, I don't flush the toilet, ever. That's

Speaker 3: 1:13:24

disgusting.

Speaker 2: 1:13:25

As

Speaker 3: 1:13:26

someone who, uh, has you over quite a bit.

Speaker 2: 1:13:29

I did it earlier. I know. Okay.

Speaker 3: 1:13:32

I know. I'm aware.

Speaker 2: 1:13:32

And I just want you to know that it's really nice that you don't say anything.

Speaker 3: 1:13:35

Cause I just, I don't have the strength, Colleen. That's fair.

Speaker 2: 1:13:38

I also like, another thing that bothers Fiona and Erin, and I don't, I never noticed that I did it ever in my entire life until I lived with them both together.

Speaker 3: 1:13:45

Yeah.

Speaker 2: 1:13:45

And then Fiona called me out for it, then Erin said, yeah, she's always done that. I was like, oh, I never even noticed. I don't like dry myself off in the shower. I just get out and walk. What? And I never thought that was weird. You don't do a pat down? No. You're just soaking wet, traipsed through your apartment? Yeah. I've, I've always done that my entire life. Like you step on the towel

Speaker 3: 1:14:05

and you just

Speaker 2: 1:14:06

kind of like dry your feet on the towel when you step on it. I'll have to ask

Speaker 3: 1:14:08

Paula. What's a weird thing that I do?

Speaker 2: 1:14:11

Yeah, that's true. Paula would know. Paula would definitely know. Erin would know.

Speaker 3: 1:14:14

I haven't lived with Erin in a really long time though. I know,

Speaker 2: 1:14:16

but I feel like I have the same habits from when I was younger.

Speaker 3: 1:14:18

All right, well, I'll get back to you with something more annoying. Unless we've

Speaker 2: 1:14:20

gotten more annoying over the years, maybe. For sure.

Speaker 3: 1:14:22

Okay. Not a doubt in my mind.

Speaker 2: 1:14:25

Well, you guys think of what's something annoying you do. Yeah,

Speaker 3: 1:14:27

what's an annoying thing you do now that you live with someone who pointed it out to you? Tell me.

Speaker 2: 1:14:31

Tell me. I was one

Speaker 3: 1:14:33

time dating a guy who said to me, Do you know that you say 11 a. m. in the morning? Or like 10 p. m. at night?

Speaker 2: 1:14:41

Mmm, I've never noticed that you do that. I didn't either

Speaker 3: 1:14:44

until he pointed it out to me.

Speaker 2: 1:14:46

Interesting.

Speaker 3: 1:14:48

I think I'm aware of it now, so I've stopped.

Speaker 2: 1:14:50

Yeah, maybe. But I caught myself doing

Speaker 3: 1:14:52

it and was like, oh my god, what am I doing? You say wid a lot

Speaker 2: 1:14:55

without realizing that you say it. What? Like, you'll say Caesar salad with wid steak tips, instead of with. Wid? Yes, but you say it so quick that you don't notice it, but I notice it. Wid? Yeah, you'll be like a Caesar salad with steak tips, but you say it like that, instead of with. That's so fucking random. I know, I think I was thinking about that the other day. Why? Because you were saying something while we were recording and I think I was like, I wonder if she's ever noticed that she did that,

Speaker 3: 1:15:20

does that. No, I've never heard of that, that's fucking crazy.

Speaker 2: 1:15:23

It's only certain contexts though.

Speaker 3: 1:15:25

Like if you were like,

Speaker 2: 1:15:26

I went to the mall, I went to the bar with Leanne, you wouldn't say with Leanne. You would just be like,

Speaker 3: 1:15:31

with,

Speaker 2: 1:15:31

you would say with probably.

Speaker 3: 1:15:32

Is it when I'm talking fast?

Speaker 2: 1:15:34

I don't know. I think so. I think that's what it is. You know who does it? Your mom.

Speaker 3: 1:15:38

Oh, that's probably why. Yeah. When I was a kid, I would say chicken fingers and french fries so fast. It was such a heavy accent that they would bring me chicken fajitas all the time.

Speaker 2: 1:15:45

Really?

Speaker 3: 1:15:45

Yeah.

Speaker 2: 1:15:46

It's also interesting in the same place that you could get a good chicken finger and also a fajita.

Speaker 3: 1:15:50

The Outback.

Speaker 2: 1:15:53

There we have it.

Speaker 3: 1:15:54

That brown bread.

Speaker 2: 1:15:55

I would die for it. I've been there in years.

Speaker 3: 1:15:57

We should go to the OPAC and get some cheese fries and some brown bread and that's it. I

Speaker 2: 1:16:01

don't think I've ever had their cheese fries. I'm

Speaker 3: 1:16:02

surprised you like those. You've never had their Aussie fries?

Speaker 2: 1:16:05

No, I literally have not been there probably in like two decades. Do you know why I love them? That's dramatic, I'm listening to this. Because

Speaker 3: 1:16:09

it's shredded melted cheese, er, sorry, it's shredded cheese versus nacho orange cheese. I don't like the, the gooey liquid of cheese. I like cheese that's been sprinkled and then melted. Okay. If that makes sense.

Speaker 2: 1:16:24

No it doesn't.

Speaker 3: 1:16:25

With bacon and chives. So

Speaker 2: 1:16:26

like a baked potato kind of thing. Fuck

Speaker 3: 1:16:27

my shit right up, but with a french fry instead of a baked potato.

Speaker 2: 1:16:31

Slay.

Speaker 3: 1:16:33

Anyway. Anywho. Tell us about the annoying things that you do. I also have not said this in God only knows how long, but if you are new here, hi, hello, and you would like to support us, if you could follow us on Instagram at SippingWithTheShannons or what would be even lovelier is if you actually rated us. On a scale from one to five, we hope it's a five. And if it's anything less than that, then you keep that rating to yourself.

Speaker 2: 1:16:55

Please do. I can't imagine anyone would give us anything lower than a five. Like, come on.

Speaker 3: 1:16:59

They're Delulu. Have

Speaker 2: 1:16:59

they not heard us?

Speaker 3: 1:17:01

Have they not heard us? And how annoying we are?

Speaker 2: 1:17:04

They hear my voice and they're like, immediate zero.

Speaker 3: 1:17:06

But that's, that's the best way to support us is to rate us on Apple Podcasts and that's how other people find us. So if you could do that, that would be lovely. Gorgeous. And we hope you all have a wonderful week. I hope you don't get dysentery. Take And I hope you also don't get scurvy.

Speaker 2: 1:17:20

I wonder who the last person in this country was to get dysentery.

Speaker 3: 1:17:24

I don't know.

Speaker 2: 1:17:25

I'm gonna look it up.

Speaker 3: 1:17:26

Okay.

Speaker 2: 1:17:26

Or scurvy.

Speaker 3: 1:17:27

Keep us posted. I feel

Speaker 2: 1:17:28

like that's something like, I almost said obsolete, but like that's not the word to use, but like doesn't exist anymore. Like, you know, people are like, oh my god, TB, this person has tuberculosis. Like, no, they don't, you know?

Speaker 3: 1:17:36

Yeah.

Speaker 2: 1:17:37

I got tested for it once.

Speaker 3: 1:17:37

Medicine. Modern medicine.

Speaker 2: 1:17:40

Modern medicine. Vaccines. That's all.

Speaker 3: 1:17:45

All right, everybody. Love you. Mean it.

Speaker 2: 1:17:46

Love you. Mean it.

Speaker 3: 1:17:47

Bye.

Speaker: 1:17:47

This podcast

Speaker 3: 1:17:59

was produced by me, Bridget Shannon. Music is written and performed by Matt Derosiers. You can find his band Super Stoker anywhere you listen to music.